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Comment by foundZero
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OK, I feel it. Recently I've tired of doing repetitive "101" type raps to neophytes and concentrated on some behind the scenes stuff.

As far as pathology in the movement, and leaving aside the fact that 100% of the rest of society thinks we're bonkers, it's reasonable to conclude that we provide a set of explanations for people who are just plain bent (for whatever reason). However, I've never been convinced that normative behavior isn't a form of collective insanity. In fact I'm more convinced than ever it is.

Aaron Russo once told me that all the rich people he knew were miserable and all the poor people he knew, in spite of their difficulties, they were the happy ones. And to drive it home he said all the rich people he knew, they hated their lives, their wives and kids hated them, the dog was probably in there pissing on the floor or biting them, sounded like hell. Wanna be rich or happy? A few in this world seem to have both wealth and happiness, and I'm happy for them, but remember, tragedy strikes us all in this world, both rich and poor, and in grief we are all the same.

Anyways, about the attack-oriented nature of our movement, you know I'm in there. I try not to attack the individual, just ideas but this time was different. I attacked the individuals who are coopting our movement and I knew full well it would result in hurt feelings. But it's not a permanent condition.

Movements go through evolutions. They go through ebbs and flows. When they ebb, all that activist energy tends to turn inwards. And malicious. It straightens out in time. Don't mistake structural elements and ideological disputes with ineffectuality. And try not to take things personally.

Now as to you kicking yourself because you have not yet moved to the forest, made best friends with a grizzly and learned how to make your own granola, it takes years to build up un-tilled soil and even more to learn what to do with it. And given as we're in A FREAKING DESERT, the chances for "living off the land" are absolutely, positively, unchangeably REMOTE for most listeners. Or readers. Whatever. I'm not trying to discourage you or anybody but self-sufficiency isn't something you turn on like a light. For my purposes, self-sufficiency for me is preparing to move to South Carolina or some place where the winters are benign, the growning season is long, the soil is near as black as coal and there's water all freaking over the place. Back there, 5 acres of mature woodlot will yield all the firewood a family needs without impacting the asset--the living trees--one bit.

I think in terms of preperation....hey fuck, I don't have to think, I KNOW BY LOOKING AT THE BOARDS that even most patriots DON'T have their long term food supplies laid up and DON'T have their Berkey water filters and DON'T have essential self reliance supplies, not even a freaking hammer and more times than you'd think they STILL DON'T have firearms, ammo or the training to use them and they often STILL DON'T have any gold or silver.

So a hint to you still-unprepared: don't quit the day job until you get some essential gear and supplies at least.

To wrap up, to you brothers in the Valley, to reassure you, I'm in Prescott, one of your last, best evac routes if TSHTF. There's things I can only tell you in private, but in public, make it here, you are under my covering and my mobile kitchen equipment is capable of feeding however many of us show us, subject to the actual food supplies I'd expect you to bring. It's even all legal and inspected and insured. And in a crisis, I can find places to put a bunch of us providing everybody has tents and sleeping bags.

The big thing is getting you here in a big ass hurry and like Ernie has said, you need to know your local barriers. In many ways they get easier but different after that guys. We need to talk this one through. For your sake.

I think that will give you peace of mind. But honestly people, I don't think, as Ernie says, it will happen overnight. Or if there is that moment, I hope we will have already got the fuck out of the desert and regrouped someplace else.

I dunno, I got people in the movement telling me I can come here, go there and live with them but my question is always the same: can I bring 50 or 100 of my pals with me?

Don't matter what happens to me. I like doing what I do. Feeding large amounts of people in primitive circumstances has always appealed to me. Organizing around priorities with capable dudes to assist women and children close at hand has always seemed natural to me. Basically I'll be marketing all those skills in the post-economy.

Take heart Jet, your medical experience will pay off bigtime in that scenario. Ah, so you don't bother with a "first aid kit" or even your jump kit or trauma bag, bro, what I like to carry I refer to as a "microsurgery". For all intents and purposes, in a post-economy, we're "Doc".

Comment by foundZero
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Sorry to rang on your thread Jet, I'd like to call some of this stuff in on the broadcast, but there's some lessons we learned from the folks in the post-Soviet Union that are interesting.

Ernie, the guys, us, me, we're always talking about tradabilty and fungabilty of our supplies, in other words "have stuff you can trade for other stuff you need". So we all focus on "junk silver", bullets, Ernie was talking about primers today on the show, all totally cool.

The post-Soviet model, especially in combat zones of Bosnia-Hertzogovena showed us that the most mundane or even seemingly stupid stuff can have great value.

I was laughing at your for toilet paper but you were close. Spice. Bullion cubes. Something to make bland food taste better or just different. You can get in on a meal from people who have a pot of rice with a single bullion cube. Because they are food-fatigued. Salt. It not only flavorful but it has preservative and multiple medicinal uses. You wouldn't believe it but perfume. People over-used to privation will trade food for the chance to feel human again.

Yo boys, Bic lighters. In a post-economy people will revert to burning things to make heat and cook food. The ability to make fire, as brother Ed will tell you is one of the 3 things a man should never be without.

For you young brothers, the wisdom of Ed is that a man should never be without 3 things:

1. A knife.

2. The abilty to make fire.

3. The abilty to defend one's self.

And since, even if you know how to make a fire with bow and spindle, it is very hard to find the right types of wood to make a bow and spindle and kindle, you are pretty much screwed without a lighter and that makes them a hell of a trade item AND so far as I know, they have a pretty damn ass long shelf life.

Booze and tobacco: if you don't drink or smoke, man do those ever make good trade items in a post-economy. The tobacco will eventuall go stale but the booze, bro, that's a durable investment. If you drink or smoke, don't even bother, that's not an investment strategy, that's your entertainment budget.

Comment by foundZero
Entered on:

Hey Jet would you believe me if I said this would be my last reply to your post?

I composed a little song for you.

(ahem memememememme)

Oh Jetster remove thyself not from the movement

for your music always hath the groovement

and us tiny humans, we find no improvement

with any implications of your self-removement.

not the river but the streeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeam.

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Comment by Jet Lacey
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For one, you Sir, crack me up. 

Secondly, for whatever reason (and I can only go on well-documented historical precedent), no, I don't believe your latest post will be your last word on this subject. lol.  

Thirdly (is that a word?), you gave me some great information and insight that I really appreciate. 

That was somewhat the point of the article, which was not to point fingers or to assign blame, which I gather you understood.  What I really want to know is whether or not activism is worth the time and effort at this point in the game (the game I call American society), which I can only guess is somewhere in the neighborhood of "late in the 4th quarter."  



Comment by Anonymous
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 Hey Jet!

You will not retreat from the freedom movement, nor should you!

This article is a milestone that marks your transition from follower to leader.

Have you noted that all patriots-for-profits appeals are collective appeals?

Have you noted that all assholery (and jackassery for that matter) among "freedom activists" are typically COLLECTIVIST in nature?  Such as an individual claiming something on behalf of (all of the) "grassroots"?  When in fact that individual as no f-ing clue what's in the mind of the person standing immediately next to him/her?

Ironic, huh.

No, just apply the old victorian standards, maintain appearances, keep a stiff upper lip and always be civil, kind when you can, firm when you have to, and motor on my brotha.

You can prepare your family in parallel.  If it's a resources thing, then don't spend your resources on EVERY big L libertarian idea.  Just be a little more picky and choosey.  Only pick the good ideas.  (I know big Ls hate to hear that just because they have an idea doesn't mean its a good one!  LOL)


Comment by Nunya
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 But....Jet...'sniff' sniff' can't go!  Who am I going to listen to when I have too much Ernie in my head?  Whose gonna provide that calming voice and that intelligent humor? 

I understand where you're coming from.  I reached a similar place about a year or so ago.  I went from wanting to scream from the rooftops about all the injustice that is happening behind the general population's blinders to just not wanting to be around any sheeple at all because they are too stupid to waste my time on.  I still struggle with that.  It's not like the plans to rule the world are anything new....they've been there forever and it still hasn't happened yet....a Pinky and the Brain reference comes to mind.

I do, every once-in-awhile gather enough faith in the general population to throw out a good "conversation starter" just to test the crowd I'm in.  People who are happy giving 60% of their paychecks to the man so that we can be "free" are not the kind of people I want to argue with - they just waste my time.  It's those who, like I was, grew up being spoon-fed their opinions and when presented with the option that there is truth out there to be found, become enlightened. 

I also understand about getting yourself prepared first.  With my limited resources, I put much of my time and effort into my affairs, with a little time and effort into those causes that make me feel good to support.  You can have the best of both worlds and if you're not having fun, you're not doing something right! 

Oh...which reminds me...I would be very interested in your infinite health wisdom as I am starting a website devoted to truthful health information.  It's pretty simple, but if you would like to start a health blog, I'd love to link to it on my website.

So, don't be going anywhere, Jet, I'd miss you.....besides I know where you live!  :)

Comment by Keith Hamburger
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 So, this is the comment and argument I post anywhere and everywhere this stuff comes up.

When I'm feeling optimistic I think our economy is going to collapse within the next couple of years and our country will break up into six or more regions, some of which will have some semblance of freedom.

When I'm feeling pessimistic I think that the powers that be will drag this whole charade out for another decade or more ending in a Weimar or Zimbabwe style collapse and a second coming, of Hitler and/or Stalin.

Either way the best thing to do is try to reach as many people as possible with the message of true freedom and liberty.  The meme has to be spread if we're ever going to stand a chance.

Beyond that stock statement there is a whole lot more.  After nearly 3 decades in this effort at various levels and through numerous channels, I have given up on a political solution or very much in the way of group efforts.  Freedom can only come through a mass understanding of the realities of power.  I do still support candidates who I think are doing a good job of spreading the message but not because I think that electing them will make any difference, but because it is an effective method of education in many cases.

As for me, I've been through it all.  Running for office, chairing the LP, working through the major parties to promote liberty candidates, and more.  But, now it's just writing and posting and arguing and, hopefully, educating.  That's going to be the real answer.  And, with the platforms and connections you have available you are doing an awesome job of it.  I hope you keep it up.

Comment by Tom W.
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I have to disagree with Oyate on the farming thing. I have a neighbor (mesa, az) who has converted his one acre back yard into a heck of an organic farm. He's producing mean tomatos, carrots, lettice, etc. He's expanded and has leased another three acres. North of me, someone has leased 100 acres of reservation land and producing very nice organic produce. Another neighbor has a well and I'm sure would trade his water for produce (if SRP stopped delivering). South of me, a five acre vacant lot has been converted to a corn field.

 This is all new produce generation that didn't exist 3 years ago. Food will be available to those who have the skills and knowhow that have something to trade. 

 I hate to see us go back to caveman days where 100% of people are farmers, there's no need. Hone your skills, stockpile medical supplies. When the government is not there to tell you you can't practice, your skills will come in handy. Stick with the radio thing. When trade routes brake down, you may find yourself at the center of the trade route (i.e. advertising) as the 'too big to fail' Walmarts etc. collapse. The key is to keep the small businesses networked, they will thrive at this time (bacause their large competetors are colapsing).

This is why I have shifted some of my activisim to the community market square thing. To get people thinking about what skills they have and how to trade them for stuff like food that at some point might keep them alive.








Comment by Anonymous
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 "But, now it's just writing and posting and arguing and, hopefully, educating.  That's going to be the real answer."

Actually, no, that will just land you in the camps and get you the derision of your neighbors.  S**t, in fact, it will be your neighbors who turn your a** in!  Probably for "food hoarding".

It's been awhile since you've read SunTzu.  It's always a good refresher to pick up and reread every couple years.


Comment by Mitch Vallely
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 Hey Jet,

Sounds to me like you've been drinking too much flouridated tap water, Son. Why don't you take your *weak*, pathetic, self-defeatist attitude and move to some foreign place, like; Nicaragua?

You are a pathetic excuse for an AMERICAN!

Comment by Keith Hamburger
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 If one succumbs to fear they can always become a hermit and die alone.  However, if one really wants real change there is going to have to be a change in the attitudes and beliefs of a large percentage of the population.

Certainly I could go into hiding and never speak out or take action and keep myself safe.  Or, I could go out with guns blazing and hope to take as many of the bastards with me.

But, for me, I'm just not suited to run around posting anonymously and failing to take a stand for freedom or otherwise hiding from those that wish to have power over me and mine.  Nor am I willing to make fruitless and potentially counterproductive gestures.

So, I'll take a stand where I can and the best avenue I can see at this point is to try to educate as many as possible because without a certain level of support for freedom the risk for tyranny and disaster is much greater.

Comment by Keith Hamburger
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 Interesting.  My name isn't associated with either of my posts even though I said I "refuse to post anonymously".  It says I'm logged in but the name isn't showing.

So ...  For the record, this is being posted by Keith Hamburger.

Guess I'm headed for the camps after all.

Comment by foundZero
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Keith, we think we know what's happening. Your posts are getting routed to the dollar menu. ;)

Comment by foundZero
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Tom W I really would have thought you knew better than to disagree with the Great Oyate but instead of roasting you where you stand with my supernatural powers, I'll ask a few questions that might be instructive. To like....somebody out there.

This friend of yours, is his land flat? Is the soil free of major rocks and stumps? Was it, like much of the land in the valley, former agricultural land (thence having had the benefit of decades of tilling)?

A yes to any of these are real advantages many folks might not have.

It does sound like your friend is doing a kickass job and I'd love to check it out. Sounds like he's verging on real production.

Especially with some urban agricultural techniques, "vertical agriculture" and raised-bed and in colder climates, cold frames and even those plastic temporary greenhouses can radically extend a growing season, a single acre can yield all kinds of produce but it won't feed a family.

For that you need high-calorie, high-protein foods like beans and grains. Grains in particular take up a BUNCH of space.

And I don't think a lot of readers understand that you and your friend live in a climate that affords a 360 DAY PER YEAR GROWING SEASON. Folks, you should see it. They do have seasons in terms of summer, spring and winter crops but they are yanking things out of the ground here every day of the year.

Comment by Jack Walleye
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I applaud your post.

Nothing beats growing your own food.  We have just over an acre in Phoenix and we have over 60 fruit trees and many vegetables & fruit in the garden.  We have so much, the wife cans a lot of it and we were giving it away to the neighbors.  We also sell our fresh produce.  We have a few beef cows and upwards of 150 chickens/ducks/rabbits.  Growing food in Phoenix is not difficult, its in the planning.    

Demons have aligned themselves very closely with politics because they realize they only have a short time left here.  There seem to be more than our share of them in the movement. 

Take good care of you and your family.



Comment by Charles Gillespie
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Hey Brother,

 We both woke up in the shit-house-on-fire about the same time (Annual Reading of the Bill of Rights at the Wrigley Mansion) and I know we carry different perspectives on some issues but somehow match up very close on most. I for one feel that I'm much better for having met you and would feel pretty crappy if you weren't hanging around assessing and illuminating the NWO's death-grip on humanity for us.

I agree with your description of 'the crowd' that seem to come out of the woodwork with Lady Liberty's distress call. My own fractured life is legendary...even  in hell, but I still can't help but feel for others I've met along the way who seem to have it worse in various ways.

I think it would be "Kick Ass" to have a 'Freedom Town' somewhere out in the middle of nowhere with a bunch of peeps that know how to fend for themselves and are fully integrated when the walls come down.

Anyway dude, I know where you are coming from in more ways than one. I hope you don't let the gregarious few who flagrantly distort their perception of reality in pursuit of glory run you off or change your purpose. That would upset the apple-cart in many ways in my eyes.

Comment by foundZero
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Check the support for the Jetster!

Hey bro, this is how it feels. Nice eh? The people run up to you like a bunch of attention-starved ponies and man, when you feed them and the 3VOL goes down, dude, brother,

you are getting a moment. I call it serendipity-doo-da-day. and my advice at this time is to simply take a day off an relish in it.

For the truth is brother, that many of us bask in the sunshine of your love. And it's real brother because our movement is born of fear and reactivity but young brothers like you and 4409 are the new production.

 Young brothers, at this point you have read everything, you have internalized the spirit of freedom and I will tell you what you already know:


In other words, you have taken responsibility, you know what it feels like and you know now the nature of "taking responsibility".

Everybody else sees it as a negative but to us it's low-hanging fruit. Or a cosmological principle. Responsibility is there, you just TAKE IT. You take it because nobody else does. You take it because it is there. You take it because there is nobody to stop you.

A long time before I studied marshal arts a man told me "it don't matter who knows ka-ra-tey or some shit, you just take your shit and kick their ass". And that was a long time before I was an activist. And that was a way, way long time before I got this heavy-duty native trip laid on me. But since that time, I want to tell you that as your elder, as one whom has gone before you, and this goes for Jet and 4409 and all you other ranks of young people, we are proud of you, we appove of you, we are so very proud of you that you make our eyes shine. Libertarians have been trying for 30 years, fuck that, my people, our people have been waiting for 7 generations. Seven generations to see this, to see you, to see you now, to see you here, and here you are.

You young people want to talk about gate keepers? Yeah, hi. We tried to keep the door open long enough to where you can go through it. Young people I tell you in truth that most of us have edged into despair, just look at LP.

But young ones, there is one thing that has made us unique among movements: we have always been scholar-driven. Our scholars are our equivalent of native elders. They are a source of guidance and to us activists, a way of staying on target, a focus point because our way has always been such: out scholars give us guidance and it's our job to inpterpret it as best we can for we are the street people and we are the mountain people and we are the river people and we are the salt water people, we are the people and survival for us little humans has always been about expressing knowledge from generation to generation.

Youngers, you are doing everyting exactly right and your Toa and your ancestors clearly appove of you and as you grow plants and animals, these will sing the Sacred Land Song to you and the plants will grow for you. The good news is you can do what you can and it will, it will absolutely, it will as sure as the sun will rise tomorrow in the East do good. But youngers, I tell you with all my authority to GO FOR IT AND LET NOBODY OR NOTHING HOLD YOU BACK subject to our usual warrior limitations: do no harm. Only conemlpate violence in defense of yourself or another and then only to the minimum necessary to protect our assets.

Assets is a wonderfully inclusive word. We save our asses and then we save our ass-ettes. The females and the chidlren.

Although this gives discredit to the many fine female warriors in the movement who can kick many or our decorated male asses in a fair fight. I'm thinking of specific names here. And while many men would spring to defend the honour and well being of the beautiful and glamorous Donna Hancock, sister women, by any fault of what us dickbags are doing has left you with the impression that you, as our females, are not NUMBER ONE?

Brothers, we have cause to reflect every day. Will we protect one another or our families.

A natural female will default to "you protect me and these kids all the time every day" but as warriors we must protect more than this, we must protect the tribe, for female, there is no future for our child.


WOMEN NOT OF OUR MOVEMENT this will sound very strange to you as we say we need you to be women now. Just as we say to all young men NOT OF OUR MOVEMENT, we need you to be real men now and take responsibility. For the brothers of the movement are unanimous by deed and action and our message is clear:

You can actually be one of us.

In other words, there is still room in the human race. Join it. We are waiting for you. Mijace Oyate. And I belive I can speak for my brothers and siters in the R3VOlUTION, we welcome you, we recieve you and man oh man are we glad to see you again because we missed you. And let us forget what has gone before and just have joy that you are back.

Welcome home. We missed you so much. Yes you. You. Whomever you are reading these words, welcome home. We love you, we are so glad to see you back again.

Now strap on your sword and your shield, we have work to do,

Comment by foundZero
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Young brothers and sisters, you should know that in tradition there is no translation for the word "forgive".

It was an utterly alien contruct in our minds. Before that, there was only action and the judement of the people upon whether it was a good idea, hey yo.

As my sister Renee quotes "my people are persecuted for lack of knowledge" I also see  that my people are presecuted for a lack of love".

The implicit word is "love".

And here comes the tough parts;

Won't all those people who didn't dring and smoke feel foolish one day when they are dying of nothing?/

A bird in the hand is worth eating, for you might not know when your next meal is coming from.

 Fuck me, old Oyate is telling stories again. Would you belive me if I told you I love you? Not just Jet but YOU, yes you.

Would you believe a bird that just flew across your house? That was me. You can choose to believe it or not.


You people can believe anything you want but this is the sound of many people that love you.

Comment by Jet Lacey
Entered on:

Thank you to everyone who participated in the first half of my experiment.  I sincerely appreciate all the effort and thought put into the comments. 

I have a few words for certain individuals in response, so here goes:

Oyate….thanks for all the great and well thought out comments….I’ve said it before, so I’ll say it again; methinks you need a hobby, Dude.  BTW, I'll return your phone call later today.

Keith, don't worry too much.  For all of us who met you at the Freedom Summit, we know you're a stand-up guy.  My wife Beth and I think Hamburger Patty is pretty kick-ass too!

As for you Bitch, I mean Mitch, I must admit that I’m confused.  How exactly do I have a “*weak*, pathetic, self-defeatist attitude?” (sic)  Furthermore, if I am what you consider to be a pathetic excuse for an American because I will look out for my family first … then I’m proud as a peacock to be that.  Please, by all means, return to whatever bridge from under which you previously emerged you big-mouthed troll*.

To - Charles, Jack, Tom, Michele and Anonymous, I offer a sincere thanks for your kind words of encouragement.  Just know, I haven’t decided to quit; not at all.  What I am sure of is that I must find a better balance between family activism and societal activism.

Also, thank you to Chip, Doug, and Citizen X who emailed me privately with their comments.   

* -  For the record, I’m so sick and tired of these “Dust Devil “ internet bad-asses who kick up a little wind but are more of an annoyance than anything.  If you must behave like a counter-clockwise spinning chiindii, take it somewhere else or I’ll have to get all Corpse-poison Way on your ass. (look it up)

Again, please Stay Tuned for Part II coming up this weekend - (The “Pros” portion of the discussion)


Comment by Anonymous
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 Oyate, yes we must love our brothers and sisters.  But, other than, I guess, if you are on the path of the Buddha, Krisha, or JC, love does not produce measurable political results.

I know we all love and respect the bike rider for liberty, for example, but he did not yield one single additional vote.  Nor did he raise awareness among the electorate, except perhaps for an additional .000001% of the people who were not already in "the movement".

I know it's hard to hear, but take a lesson from the Objectivists and Renzulli (you'll never hear me say THAT again!), just because you have an idea doesn't mean it's a good one.  This is where the big L's often break their heads against the brick wall of what's called "logical consistency".

There's no love in logic.  Just a small l.


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