The "room" is real, because I can see it in the laser without DMT. It's just not any more real that those dot/line pictures you stare at and see a 3D ship in them (autostereogram). I can also see there handily https://www.reddit.com/r/blackmagicfuckery/comments/ow8dpm/for_those_who_have_a_hard_time_seeing_these_types/ It's just our vision system trying to find a flat surface in a mess of laser dot effects. As far as the Matrix writing source code, and the beings stuff, I bet that the DMT. It's neat, but once I got out the laser and could see the "room" inside it, this kind of fell apart for me.